[GET] (offtopic): Solid Reasons To Get Vaccinated

[mthomas]

Quote:"New anti-vaccine organizations also began fund-raising in earnest, bringing in millions of dollars, both from wealthy donors and by selling fear. They use this money to create slick propaganda for larger audiences, such as a spate of anti-vaccine films like “Vaxxed,” which provided a blueprint for pandemic denialism films like “Plandemic.” And they donate funds to the politicians they hope to win over."

That's funny as the EXACT same thing can be said for the whole VACs movement [run by Dr. Death Fauci and his political cohorts to steal power away from the people and force them to do what THEY think you should do.....all the while exempting themselves from having to do it!!!!!], the BS "man-made" global warming movement (ie fake carbon exchanges, electric/wind/solar power nonsense, etc.), the political movements (BLM, Antifa [what a joke btw, Fascists calling anyone that doesn't agree with them Fascists), etc.) and other fear mongering "movements from the past....(hole in ozone, acid rain, over population, running out of food/oil/resources, arctic ice melting, NYC underwater by 2014, then 2018, then 2025?, etc......and on and on it goes for the benefits of a select few who are in power and get to profit from it even though they know full well it's total and utter BS!

PS - The NY Times along with the Washington Post were once well-respected publications dedicated to the news and facts but have since degenerated into the sewage of social justice causes and trying to shape the news rather than report it. I would recommend taking what they have to say (report on) with a HUGE grain of salt! (yes, I know that's an oxymoron)

[Vivekananda]

(11-23-2021 06:34 AM)mthomas Wrote:  "Why aren't the large pharmaceutical firms and governments tracking all side effects from the shots/boosters and getting this out to the public, to make an informed decision?"

I can't understand this statement, as you talk about problems with possible side effects (unknown "long term side effects").
I don't see the point in claiming that drug companies and governments aren't tracking all the side effects. It hasn't been that long - unless what you mean by "long term" is a reference to a few months.
It would even be interesting to know what you mean by "long term" - if it's the brief 2 years of smithnowt, or any other term, shorter or longer.

"much of the death data is corrupted due to the giving of money to hospitals for every "covid" death"

In Brazil we had this rumor about hospitals being rewarded for each cause of death being registered as covid to generate a profit for the hospital. It was a nonsense widely denied, including by the Ministry of Health here.

"places the didn't lock down (african countries with low vaccination rates) aren't having the same infection/death rates?"

We don't know yet the answers, but there are some hypotheses.
"Why Africa, which has less than 6% of people vaccinated, is 'least affected' by COVID-19":
https://www.firstpost.com/world/why-afri...49471.html

[StevieRay]

Vivekananda tell me are they paying you like all others that get people jabbed?

TO ME YOU ARE HELPING THESE MURDERERS, AND FOR ME PERSONALY SOMEONE WHO ACTUALY NEEDS HIS ASS BANNED! GETTING PEOPLE TAKING THE DEAD JAB!
OR DID YOU TAKE IT AND ARE YOU SCARED NOW?
I WOULD!

"PEOPLE DON'T GET THIS DEAD JAB!"
IF YOU STILL WANT TO TAKE IT, I CAN'T STOP YOU!
BUT IF IT TURNS OUT BAD, DON'T SAY I DIDN'T WARN YOU!

LET THESE VAXI-NAZI'S DIG THERE OWN GRAVE!

THIS IS WHAT HAPPEND FRIDAY IN ROTTERDAM - NETHERLANDS! <<< PRETTY SICK VIDEO POLICE SHOOTING POINT BLANC!
FYI COPS RUN INTO THE CROWD WITH TANKS! NOT VANS THOSE VANS LOOK A LIKES ARE TANKS!
THEY LEFT STONES TO THROW CONVENIENT ALREADY ON THE DEMONSTRATION SQUARE! KNOWING THESE DON'T DO SHIT TO THE TANK!

LOOK WHAT'S ALSO A PROVEN FACT: WE CALL THESE ROMEO'S - COPS STARTING THE RIOTS THAN GET THE PEOPLE TO TAKE THE BLAME!



MAKE YOUR OWN CHOICE WHEN YOU STILL HAVE ONE! CANADIANS AND AUSTRIANS DON'T HAVE A CHOICE NO MORE!
THEY WILL BE JABBED OR THROWN INTO FEMA CAMP!..........CHEW ON THAT FOR A FEW!

GUYS UNITE INSTEAD OF GETTING DIVIDED! WE ALL NEED EACH OTHER IN THIS EPIC BATTLE AGAINST THE NAZI'S-V50.0-2021 AND BEYOND!

OHHHH DID I MENTION THE RITUAL CHILD RAPES/MURDERS ...........

STAY SAFE STAY STRONG STAY HEALTHY AND HELP EACH OTHER AS MUCH AS YOU CAN!

CMC

[StevieRay]

*** THE REAL BILL AND MELINDA GATES WERE HUNG IN AFRICA IN 2013! ***
After trying out a vaccine among 5000 children!

They all died or became paralyzed!
Their parents were so furious, THEY HUNG THEIR ASSES ON A TREE!

THE ONES YOU SEE NOW ARE 2 OF THE MANY, MANY CLONES WITHIN OUR SOCIETY!

[mthomas]

There are many people that have experienced adverse health reactions (both major and minor) to either or both the initial shots and/or the booster shots. Young athletes are dying on the game fields from heart attacks (higher in number in the past two years....Hmmmmm, what is different?) and many other young people in perfect health prior to the shots are experiencing heart issues after they get one or more of the shots. They claim they are tracking these health issues but when you watch the video's they say little to nothing is being done to help them, ask them for followup and/or getting this information out to the public...(like they are required to do when you see any of those TV commercials marketing drugs...they ALWAYS list a LONG list of possible side effects).
There is even some issue with HOW the shots are administered (they don't aspirate the syringe) and this also isn't being addressed as a possible cause of some of these health complications.. (I'm not saying this IS an issue, just that they are sweeping all of these questions under the table and keeping it from the public AND NOT making health providers do this simple procedure that would take less than 3 seconds to do as a possible way of alleviating some of the reported heart health issues). Again, I'm not a doctor and they aren't 100% certain this is the reason for the health issues BUT they aren't looking into it and it's such an easy freaking fix.....they make useless masks which have been scientifically proven to not be effective against a virus that passes right through the mask yet they won't take the added extra precaution of aspirating a syringe that takes a total of 3 seconds to do?????
And people wonder why they don't trust medical professionals who have supposedly taken an oath to do no harm!!!

False reporting of Covid deaths might not be an issue in Brazil but it absolutely IS in the USA! Families of loved ones that have died from other causes are fighting with hospitals to get the death certificates changed with the correct cause of death. Any time you provide a monetary incentive to do/report something you will find fraud and especially since there is no (that I'm aware of) standard reporting requirements for what is and what is not considered a Covid related death. For example, there have been many stories of hospitals reporting vehicular DOA deaths being reported as Covid deaths because they gave them a covid test after death and it came back positive......unbelievable and they should be criminally prosecuted for fraud!

As for Africa and parts of India that have MASSIVELY lowered rates of both infection and death rates, this is a major scientific question that has NOT been researched enough or adequately and therefore we do NOT know enough to FORCE PEOPLE TO TAKE SHOTS THAT MIGHT NOT EVEN WORK BETTER THAN NATURAL IMMUNITY (which seems to be working in Africa, India and some other countries).....

Again, this is basic common sense and logical thinking based on the available science which shows MAJOR differences between highly vaccinated area's and those with low vaccination rates as well as area's that have used cheap antibiotic's and other drugs (Ivermectin) with seemably outstanding results as both a prophylactic and as a cure. Not saying this is proven science at this point but it also.hasn't been disproven and therefore forcing people to do something that could have potential future health issues (with NO responsiblity on the part of the pharmaceutical companies....you CAN'T SUE THEM!) is an illogical, irrational, unscientific, and uneducated decision.

[jimmythesaint]

again very well said.. and I applaud you for this

(11-23-2021 06:34 AM)mthomas Wrote:  

Quote:It may seem obvious, but it must be said that individual freedom ends (or should end) when it bumps into collective freedom, even more when we deal with a matter of public health.

This is at the heart of the matter.
I get that you are from Brazil so it might be hard for you to grasp the intricacies of the Freedom contained in the US Constitution and our history of individual freedoms over those of the collective (Government)....Although, I will agree there are times such as during WWI and WWII where this was upended and SOME personal freedoms were curtailed/suspended in order to win the war. (ater which they were reinstated as person rights/freedoms again).

I get a health emergency however this so called "pandemic" has too many falsehoods, lies, deceptions, inaccuracies, data manipulations and propaganda, reversals of "official" rules, omissions, lack of research and follow-up (ivermectin, shot side effects, masks, shut downs, etc.), conflicts of interest, greed, unlawful lawsuit protections, unlawful public distribution of private individual health information, forced mandating of EXPERIMENTAL and UNTESTED (for long term side effects) new drugs.

There is NO logical, medical or scientific reason to FORCE anyone to take these new, potentially life-threatening (either soon after receiving the shot and boosters) or from long term UNTESTED/UNKNOWN consequences whereby if it happens the drug companies (who have been found guilty of numerous felony charges in the past and have paid BILLIONS of dollars in fines for fraudulent marketing of their drugs with potential harmful consequences, are immune [pun intended] to any lawsuits against them.....like WTF? That ALONE should make any person question of safety of these new, untested [in the long term] drugs). That is NOT any conspiracy theory, that is simply common sense logic based on historical facts!
In the past:
- Drugs have been found to have potentially life-threatening side effects when they were rushed into production and mass distribution.....(ie Thalidomide, although pre-FDA testing).
- Vaccinations have also had disastrous and life-threatening outcomes (i.e. gulf war syndrome, polio vaccine deaths of children given a live dose by mistake, etc.)
- "Good" drugs that have gone through all the FDA testing that were used for years and have now been removed from use due to harmful or fatal side effects (ie Accutane, Quaaludes, etc.)
- the BILLIONS of dollars in fines paid by pharmaceutical companies for being caught lying, making fraudulent claims, and other nefarious and criminal endeavers (to make more money, increase the stock prices, trying to recoup experimentation costs for drugs, etc.)

So there have historically been valid reasons for people to question the safety of these novel, untested (long term) drugs which were mostly given by the patients at the behest of their doctors (who were educated by the pharmaceutical companies as to what these drugs were supposed to do/treat and how to administer them/dosages). Now we have Dr. Death Fauci who maintains a monetary interest in these vaccines, was caught lying to Congress and the American people about funding the Communist Chinese Lab (against US laws), not to mention about the masks (remember that BS?...OUTRIGHT LIE!) and we are all supposed to just believe this lying, untrustworthy, potential criminal that may have actually STARTED THIS ENTIRE "PANDEMIC" in the first place?????

Are you seriously kidding me?
Can you not see the outright hypocricy from this man and those in power around him?
What more do you need to understand that this whole fiasco was blown HUGELY out of proportion, the data is trickling in to show that the shutdowns, masks and vaccines were largely INEFFECTIVE in stopping the spread of the virus (although it MIGHT have been helpful in saving some of the older and most at risk but so MIGHT have Ivermectin and other lesser known drugs that are NOT being tested as they should be because they want to SELL more vaccines and booster shots....again, you talk about TRUTH in science but why is it taking 2 years in to the crises before these drugs are being double blind tested? Why aren't the large pharmaceutical firms and governments tracking all side effects from the shots/boosters and getting this out to the public, to make an informed decision? (these facts are being omitted and kept from the public, again, that is NOT a conspiracy, it's a FACT).

And just an FYI, I am not an anti-vaccer as I have had vaccines (for small pox, shingles, polio, measels, etc.) and think they are warranted because they help more than they harm, generally. However, I am also old enough to know scientists, doctor's and politicians ALL lie to you in the supposed morally challenged, name of "doing the right thing" or "doing whats best for you" or "because we know more than you" or some other BS unethical statement of intellectual superiority. NOPE, NO THANKS....I know BS what I see and smell it and you need high boots for the crap they are shoveling these past two years......

There is NO reason for kids/teens under 21 to get this vaccination AT ALL and the data PROVES IT!
Why would you make it mandatory ?
Why are you forcing young people to potentially get harmful heart complications from a vaccine that has an almost ZERO death rate for this age category?
And this also goes for age ranges from the 20's to 50's, unless there are comorbidities that the data shows might give a greater chance hf death....PERIOD, That is wnat the scientific data shows, that is NOT a conspiracy or anti-vaccine made up data, it is THEIR official data (even though much of the death data is corrupted due to the giving of money to hospitals for every "covid" death).

Again, I agree....if you want to get the shot and a booster every year until you die....go ahead, have fun make a party out of it.......but to make it mandatory in order to keep your job, or go to school or for any other reason is ludicris, illogical and has NOTHING to do with public health safety. The science shows this, the politicians/doctors/scientics ALL have vested interests in keeping this going in order to make money from it and seize power.

You might also want to ask yourself why so many educated people (PhDs) and doctors/nurses are willing to lose their jobs rather than take this drug.
Why are those in power so adamant at making EVERYONE get this shot regardless of knowing all there is to know about the potential future health consequences and conflicting data showing places the didn't lock down (african countries with low vaccination rates) aren't having the same infection/death rates?

[mthomas]

A quote from President Dwight D. Eisenhower's 1961 farewell speech:

"The Prospect of domination of the nation's scholars by Federal employment, project allocations, and the power of money is ever present and is gravely to be regarded.

Yet, in holding scientific research and discovery in respect, as we should, we must also be alert to the equal and opposite danger that public policy could itself become the captive of a scientific technological elite."

Never is this more relevant and astute than in our current situation...

[Vivekananda]

(11-23-2021 01:06 PM)CopyMyCash Wrote:  Vivekananda tell me are they paying you like all others that get people jabbed?

I'm not worried about your thinking, nor your aggressive way of expressing yourself.
I still prefer the rational way of discussing a problem that you aren't able to proof that is real.
Shifting the subject doesn't help the conversation progress.
I've never been paid by anyone to defend my point of view; believing it (or not) is your problem.
It would be just as simple for someone to claim that you are being paid by antivaxes.
If I write here, my motivation is the right to live (and survive to antivaxes).
I can't worry about all the problems in the universe.
I can't watch every single antivax video that gets posted.
I don't have the infinite capacity to verify that the videos are really what the people who put them out say they are - although sometimes I have found denials about some videos published by antivax.
In particular, these "bitchute" videos are often used by antivaxes as "proof" of something.
However, this video specifically does not bring ANY new information that proves BADLY ANY (real or imagined) problem with vaccines.
As a reasonably evolved country, investigations into the incident are expected to proceed normally.
If you want to hear only the side of this that you agree with ignoring the government's statements, that's your problem.
“The riots and extreme violence against police officers, riot police and firefighters last night in Rotterdam are disgusting to see,” he said in a statement."
(Ferd Grapperhaus, Dutch justice minister)
“Protesting is a great right in our society, but what we saw last night is simply criminal behaviour. It has nothing to do with demonstrating.”
An independent investigation into the shootings by police has been opened, as is the case whenever officers use their weapons.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/n...ns-violent

I'm already worried enough about what happens in my country, where the police often act illegally - and, in fact, on Sunday (the 21st) the police carried out a slaughter in revenge for the murder of a policeman.
Here, an independent investigation is extremely rare.

[Vivekananda]

mthomas, you said that you are not against vaccination, and that you have been vaccinated a few times.
I believe that you received these shots when you were a child, by choice of your parents. It would be interesting to know some answers about what happened when you were vaccinated:
- Did someone ask how long the vaccines had been in use, using this time period to judge whether they were "experimental" or not?
- Has anyone suspected that these vaccines have likely side effects, using this as an argument to oppose to the vaccination?
- Has anyone discussed the technologies used in their preparation?
- Has anyone put forward the very low probability of side effects as an argument against their effectiveness?
- Did anyone asked if such vaccines were been manufactured by "big pharma bad guys"?

I'm still waiting for you answer about what you mean by "long term" - if it's the brief 2 years of smithnowt, or any other term, shorter or longer.

"higher in number in the past two years....Hmmmmm, what is different?) and many other young people in perfect health prior to the shots are experiencing heart issues after they get one or more of the shots. "
This problem is real and is being tracked: https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-02740-y

"False reporting of Covid deaths might not be an issue in Brazil but it absolutely IS in the USA!"
Is this a problem caused by vaccination?

"FORCE PEOPLE TO TAKE SHOTS THAT MIGHT NOT EVEN WORK BETTER THAN NATURAL IMMUNITY (which seems to be working in Africa, India and some other countries)."
Natural immunity was not enough to help the pandemic spreading in Brazil and lots of other countries...
And you can't say the same against the vaccines.

So much to comment, so little time
"it might be hard for you to grasp the intricacies of the Freedom contained in the US Constitution and our history of individual freedoms over those of the collective"
Yes. It's hard to grasp mainly because we live in a society, not totally independent individuals. But here we lived in a militar ditatorship, I know what is to have troubles with individual freedoms.

"this so called "pandemic" has too many falsehoods, lies, deceptions, (etc.)"
Yes. From all the sides. It seems to be part of human nature

"lack of research and follow-up (ivermectin, shot side effects, masks, shut downs, etc.)"
I don't know a reason to use quotes around the word pandemic.
There was no lack of investments to research the development of vaccines.
I believe that the problem of solid research on countless remedies (and not just chloroquine, ivermectin and others) is due exactly to the large number of experiments and drugs to analyze.
It is a pandemic, an emergency, where a quick solution must be found.
When a less than perfect solution was found (through Pfizer, Sinovac, Oxford, etc.) it was well received.
So far, studies of chloroquine (and the potentially less dangerous hydroxychloroquine) have indicated its ineffectiveness, although the (ultra-right) Brazilian president continues to lie about its effectiveness.
And yes, we have Brazilian doctors with many diplomas defending this drugs, even though even the hospitals where they work have carried out studies that prove the ineffectiveness of the drugs they defend.
The common feature of these doctors is their poor training in Clinical Research on viruses.

"from long term UNTESTED/UNKNOWN consequences"
I took the two doses and I'm wait for the 3rd. I believe in the research done so far.
It's a simple choice: face the problems of a disease during a pandemic, or choose to get a vaccine designed specifically against the disease.
I'm past the age where (statistically speaking) I would have the greatest immunity to fight covid without a a vaccine.
And even if I were 18 years old and in top physical shape, the problem is that there are a lot of people, including athletes in the prime of their youth, who have already died from the disease.
I would rather face the supposed risks by getting the vaccine - risks that as far as I know are statistically IMAGINARY, than relying completely on my immune system and risk my luck.
It's a question of numbers.
Where you see a lack of logic, I see A LOT of logic.
Where you don't see medical or scientific reasons, I look at the numbers of a pandemic that starts to get under control.

I took the two doses and wait for the backup. I believe in the research done so far. Am I taking a risk? Perhaps - in YOUR opinion. Everything I researched and learned throughout my life leads me to a conclusion diametrically opposite to yours.

"the drug companies (...) have paid BILLIONS of dollars in fines for fraudulent marketing of their drugs"
If the companies spent this money, probably they have learnt the lesson.
MSD (Merck Sharp and Dohme) manufactures ivermectin (under the name Stromectol), but claims the drug is not effective against covid-19. The problem here is that the claim that the drug would work against covid would be a true "fraudulent marketing"

"- Drugs have been found to have potentially life-threatening side effects when they were rushed into production and mass distribution.....(ie Thalidomide, although pre-FDA testing)."
Thalidomide! Even this (in)famous drug is being studied to be used against covid-19.
What I see is Clinical Research progressing to avoid serious problems like those caused by thalidomide in a not-so-distant past.
If ivermectin (or chloroquine) can pass the rigorous testing of current clinical research, great!
For now, the vaccine is still a better solution.

"- Vaccinations have also had disastrous and life-threatening outcomes"
I prefer not to treat an exception as a rule. I remember that young Bruce Lee, at the height of his physical shape, died because he had a very rare reaction due to the use of a common pain reliever.

"- the BILLIONS of dollars in fines paid by pharmaceutical companies for being caught lying,"
Something similar is happening in Brazil now, but in the opposite direction -
a medical consortium specializing in elderly patients carried out tests and presented fraudulent data on the supposed "miracles" of chloroquine
Tests without patient consent, omitted data on deaths.
It is an open case that is being investigated.
The political implications of what happened in Brazil would take thousands of pages.

"So there have historically been valid reasons for people to question the safety of these novel, untested (long term) drugs"
There are solid reasons for using approved vaccines after concrete testing, following the current standards. The "historical" reasons from Thalidomide problems helped us to have more rigorous standards. At this momente there is NO concrete reason to suspect that there are long-term problems.

"Dr. Death Fauci who maintains a monetary interest in these vaccines, was caught lying to Congress and the American people about funding the Communist Chinese Lab (against US laws), "
He didn't lie, according to the denials I read. And yes, mr. Trump has a small monetary interest in the manufacture of chloroquine.

"not to mention about the masks (remember that BS?...OUTRIGHT LIE!)"
The BSs I read about the masks were in the form of rumors about the supposed (and ridiculous) side effects we would suffer from their use.

"this whole fiasco was blown HUGELY out of proportion, the data is trickling in to show that the shutdowns, masks and vaccines were largely INEFFECTIVE in stopping the spread of the virus"
It seems to me that you have VERY different data from what I have access to.
Shutdowns, masks and vaccines are working here in Brazil - although the relaxation of shutdown will probably bring an increase in the number of cases, as has occurred worldwide. At least here the antivax movement is practically irrelevant, even for historical reasons.
The problem is that other countries where isolation worked (such as New Zealand) ended up deciding to adopt a policy of coexistence with the pandemic, relaxing restrictions, but adopting testing as a way to control the pandemic.
Here in Brazil, testing is simply being ignored.
It is the difficult to find a balance between maintaining the "normal" way of life with the economy working, and fighting a disease.

[mthomas]

(11-24-2021 08:12 AM)Vivekananda Wrote:  mthomas, you said that you are not against vaccination, and that you have been vaccinated a few times.
I believe that you received these shots when you were a child, by choice of your parents. It would be interesting to know some answers about what happened when you were vaccinated:
- Did someone ask how long the vaccines had been in use, using this time period to judge whether they were "experimental" or not? The vaccinations I got had been used successfully for several years maybe closer to a decade or two. My parents were young and generally trusted their doctors back in the day.
Also, remember there wasn't an Internet around to look up these types of questions, etc., they got their answer from encyclopedia's, other Mom's, Nannies, etc.
- Has anyone suspected that these vaccines have likely side effects, using this as an argument to oppose to the vaccination? I had no adverse reaction or side effects although that is just my experience. There are other's that have said their babies have had severe side effects from these vaccinations but that is on youtube, etc. I doubt whether my parents had heard of anything back then.
- Has anyone discussed the technologies used in their preparation? There were around and used successfully for years before I was given them, so no. The ones I took as far as I know were of the "dead virus" variety and not the newer mRNA vaccines.
- Has anyone put forward the very low probability of side effects as an argument against their effectiveness? Anyone like who?
- Did anyone asked if such vaccines were been manufactured by "big pharma bad guys"? Like who, my parents? See answers above.

I'm still waiting for you answer about what you mean by "long term" - if it's the brief 2 years of smithnowt, or any other term, shorter or longer.
How about 10 years? Again there have been many examples of drugs that have been FDA approved and then after wide spread use and harmful side effects being reported they were recalled from use. Some where used for only months and some for over 20 years, so I'd say a good time frame to have people report deaths and health issues associated with the long term use of these vaccinations and booster shots.
Remember, I'm not a scientist or doctor so this is just my personal opinion and I'm NOT saying if you want to take the shot you CAN"T until the 10 years is up, I'm just saying I wouldn't take the shot/boosters until much more time has gone by to see the actual effects that these shots/booster might have on long term health.

"False reporting of Covid deaths might not be an issue in Brazil but it absolutely IS in the USA!"
Is this a problem caused by vaccination? NO, it's a problem when you manipulate the data and therefore can't trust the data to show the actual number of Covid deaths. This also increases the statistics to show a higher rate of death than it actually is.

Natural immunity was not enough to help the pandemic spreading in Brazil and lots of other countries...
And you can't say the same against the vaccines.
Yes, I can because of what's happening in Africa where there is hardly any vaccinations yet there are low levels of infection and deaths. Also, in highly vaccinated countries they are now seeing breakthrough infections that are also spreading the virus. Vaccinations did NOT stop the spread and it can be argued from some countries data that the virus would have spread the same with or without mass vaccinations.

I don't know a reason to use quotes around the word pandemic. Because this has all been hugely blown way out of proportion.
There was no lack of investments to research the development of vaccines.
I believe that the problem of solid research on countless remedies (and not just chloroquine, ivermectin and others) is due exactly to the large number of experiments and drugs to analyze.
It is a pandemic, an emergency, where a quick solution must be found.
When a less than perfect solution was found (through Pfizer, Sinovac, Oxford, etc.) it was well received.
So far, studies of chloroquine (and the potentially less dangerous hydroxychloroquine) have indicated its ineffectiveness, although the (ultra-right) Brazilian president continues to lie about its effectiveness.
And yes, we have Brazilian doctors with many diplomas defending this drugs, even though even the hospitals where they work have carried out studies that prove the ineffectiveness of the drugs they defend.
The common feature of these doctors is their poor training in Clinical Research on viruses.
Another common feature is that many of these studies are funded by the same pharmaceutical companies that stand to make billions in profits from the vaccines and little if any from already known drugs like Ivermectin.....Hmmmmm, nothing like a conflict of interest and outright greed......but then again it's not like these companies have been fined Billions in the past due to fraud, lying, deceptive marketing, etc.....OH, WAIT, THAT's RIGHT THEY HAVE!

"from long term UNTESTED/UNKNOWN consequences"
I took the two doses and I'm wait for the 3rd. I believe in the research done so far.
It's a simple choice: face the problems of a disease during a pandemic, or choose to get a vaccine designed specifically against the disease.
I'm past the age where (statistically speaking) I would have the greatest immunity to fight covid without a a vaccine.
And even if I were 18 years old and in top physical shape, the problem is that there are a lot of people, including athletes in the prime of their youth, who have already died from the disease.
I would rather face the supposed risks by getting the vaccine - risks that as far as I know are statistically IMAGINARY, than relying completely on my immune system and risk my luck.
It's a question of numbers. YES, it is and for most people under 50 with no comorbidities the risk of death is less than 1%, you know, statistically IMAGINARY!
Where you see a lack of logic, I see A LOT of logic.
Where you don't see medical or scientific reasons, I look at the numbers of a pandemic that starts to get under control.
I won't argue what you believe to be true as you are entitled to your opinion and frankly I don't care what you do or don't do....what I do care about is being forced to get a "vaccine" that doesn't stop the spread of the virus and has NOT been tested for adverse long term effects and has already killed several people and given many others severe health consequences that the large pharmaceutical companies aren't reporting and are trying to keep hidden.

I took the two doses and wait for the backup. I believe in the research done so far. Am I taking a risk? Perhaps - in YOUR opinion. Everything I researched and learned throughout my life leads me to a conclusion diametrically opposite to yours.
Again, I don't care what you decide to do or not to do, why do I have to do what YOU say? Why are people losing their jobs, being restricted on where they can go and in some countries now (Austria) being FORCED to get this experimental vaccine, not long term tested drug that can potentially kill you or cause severe health issues on it's own, and it's been PROVEN with the data that the vaccine does NOT stop the spread of the virus or how infectious a person is once they have it? THEY say it lessons that chances of death in older people with comorbidities but so does losing weight yet we hear NOTHING from the so called authorities to make it MANDATORY to lose weight, lesson sugar in our diets, reduce fast food restaurants, increase healthy eating, etc. etc, etc,.....(not that I would agree with any of that either, but the point is the data PROVES being fat is a HUGE (pun intended) RISK factor and yet NOTHING is said or done about it.


"the drug companies (...) have paid BILLIONS of dollars in fines for fraudulent marketing of their drugs"
If the companies spent this money, probably they have learnt the lesson.
Are you F#&King kidding me? They are like a methhead getting out of prison and saying he's clean and won't ever smoke meth again....yeah, right....
MSD (Merck Sharp and Dohme) manufactures ivermectin (under the name Stromectol), but claims the drug is not effective against covid-19. The problem here is that the claim that the drug would work against covid would be a true "fraudulent marketing". You're right IF it doesn't work, but after 2 freaking years of this BS, we STILL don't have a definitive answer even though some area's have reported amazing success with it. (India State of Uttar Pradesh)

"- Drugs have been found to have potentially life-threatening side effects when they were rushed into production and mass distribution.....(ie Thalidomide, although pre-FDA testing)."
Thalidomide! Even this (in)famous drug is being studied to be used against covid-19.
What I see is Clinical Research progressing to avoid serious problems like those caused by thalidomide in a not-so-distant past.
If ivermectin (or chloroquine) can pass the rigorous testing of current clinical research, great! It's already done this for drug safety with like 3.7 billion doses for Ivermectin already given for other ailments and little to no series side effects reported! It's just a matter of testing it against Covid for seriously ill patients and the A@#Hole doctor's and hospitals are BANNING it's GODDAMN use....WTF? REALLY? If someone is on the brink of death, I don't give a shit if you give them heroin if they want it. We already have seen drug companies get a free can't be sued card, give the same to dying patients (meaning they can't sue the hospital if they ask for a drug and it messes them up) and give them any d*** drug they want, including IVERMECTIN....why is that so freaking hard to grasp? (unless maybe there is more to the story? Like companies potentially losing out on all the billions from vaccines and yearly? booster shots and the money they invested in research/testing....all the while letting MILLIONS of people die because they won't test this freaking drug on dying patients for the past 2 years????? Just as an FYI, patient families are asking for this drug to be given to their dying relatives and are being DENIED. I thought we were supposed to be helping patients here?
I don't know if Ivermectin works or not, but it seemed to work OUTSTANDINGLY in a single State in India while all around them people were dying in other States that did NOT take the drug and only relied on vaccinations. Mind you the State has 241 million people. From the article: "In two weeks' time, the cases in the Ivermectin using states started to drop by half, and in six weeks, they achieved 85 to 90 percent reduction in cases. In three months, the cases further decreased by 95 percent to 99.9 percent compared to peak levels. For several months now, many states are enjoying near normal, pre Covid activities." ALSO from the article: "One can't possibly attribute it to its anti-Covid vaccination, because it's one of the slowest among the Indian States in it's vaccination rollout, with less than 5 percent of it's population fully vaccinated." You say you believe in the data, then this data SEEMS to prove that Ivermectin or some other thing (the water, food, etc.) is different than other Indian States with high infection/death rates. There should have been a MASSIVE response initiative to find out the reason for this spectacular difference in infection/death rates for this one Indian State....where was it? Nothing, NADA, Zip...in fact the WHO put out a warning against the use of Ivermectin without ANY serious testing for follow-up as to the causes of this HUGE difference between Indian States.
Ivermectin Use in India State Article

For now, the vaccine is still a better solution.

"- Vaccinations have also had disastrous and life-threatening outcomes"
I prefer not to treat an exception as a rule. I remember that young Bruce Lee, at the height of his physical shape, died because he had a very rare reaction due to the use of a common pain reliever.
I agree that there are always risks but they should be listed and patients informed and for those with these side effects tracked and given effective treatments...(which seems NOT to be happening with many of those with serious side effects). Also, why hasn't it been tested to see if needle aspiration has any advantage to protecting patients when it takes less than 3 seconds to perform? (it is simply putting the plunger back on a syringe to see if the needle is in a blood vessel and if it is, blood will appear in the syringe and the doctor/nurse should NOT push the plunger down but remove it and try in a different spot. It is thought by some doctor's that pumping this vaccine into a blood vessel whereby it is taking immediately to the heart might be why some people have such adverse serous health issues with their heart...again, I am NOT saying this is true, it hasn't been researched but in the name of safety and preventive medicine why hasn't the WHO or CDC made this a requirement when administering the vaccine? Wouldn't that be common sense? It takes all of 3 seconds to do? I thought all these lockdowns, masks, vaccines, etc., was done for our own protection....but THIS can't be done?

At this momente there is NO concrete reason to suspect that there are long-term problems.
So you are ready to stake your life on it...because that is exactly what you are doing and guess what...you have absolutely NO recourse if it turns out to actually have long term health consequences....because NO ONE can sue these companies.....yeah, great incentive for them to give a shit about long term health issues.....But again, that is totally up to you. I agree you SHOULD have the choice to make that decision, weighing all the risks and known (and unknown) factors but I certainly should have the same right to refuse to be used as a laboratory rat.

"Dr. Death Fauci who maintains a monetary interest in these vaccines, was caught lying to Congress and the American people about funding the Communist Chinese Lab (against US laws), "
He didn't lie, according to the denials I read. And yes, mr. Trump has a small monetary interest in the manufacture of chloroquine.
He absolutely lied and if there is an real investigation it will come out as such. Just because HE said he didn't lie doesn't make it a fact. There is documented evidence (emails, pdf's, etc.) where he used the exact term, "gain of function" in his correspondence regarding the illegal funding of the Communist Chinese Lab.

"not to mention about the masks (remember that BS?...OUTRIGHT LIE!)"
The BSs I read about the masks were in the form of rumors about the supposed (and ridiculous) side effects we would suffer from their use.
No, he LIED that they didn't work in order to supposedly give them to healthcare workers and said it was the right thing to do....BS! Once a liar always a liar and what else is he lying about in the name of doing the right thing?

Note: I deleted some that I didn't have anything to add to save some space!